Horizon Zero Dawn

[macstat]

Too bad its console exclusive. I need my assassins creed fix and this looks just like it (you even climb robo-dino-towers :>).

[JaySevenZero]

Too bad its console exclusive. I need my assassins creed fix and this looks just like it (you even climb robo-dino-towers :>).

More reason to pick up a PS4 sometime I guess! :)

[JaySevenZero]

Nice one Jay. My (our!) buddy Curlitos also got his platinum, he's now lent me the game. Dead excited. I'm going to dive in once I've finished Zelda.

I reckon you'll like it!

[PapaJupe13]

So did you get a theme for getting the platinum trophy?
Horizon is the first game I ever bothered to get the platinum for, really only because I did not want it to end so I did everything I possibly could.
I saw somewhere else that Sony sends you a special theme if you get the platinum trophy. Been about a month and I haven't gotten one. Not that it really matters. I am not switching out my Nioh theme.

[JaySevenZero]

So did you get a theme for getting the platinum trophy?
Horizon is the first game I ever bothered to get the platinum for, really only because I did not want it to end so I did everything I possibly could. I saw somewhere else that Sony sends you a special theme if you get the platinum trophy. Been about a month and I haven't gotten one.

Not yet. I saw some folks talking about this on twitter but I haven't received anything yet. To be quite honest though, I'm not really that bothered about themes, I just really, really enjoyed playing it

[PapaJupe13]

Yeah. The BGM my Nioh theme puts out is just too good to change.
And I adored Horizon.

[JaySevenZero]

I've seen some folks being negative towards the character animation in HZD, to which I couldn't disagree more with them, especially after I sat and watched a couple of hours of Mass Effect: Andromeda gameplay. Anyway, here's a collected sample of only a handful of characters that you'll come across on your travels in the game and I'll challenge anyone to tell me that they're badly done.*

*should be relatively spoiler free too!

[Todinho]

So I dont know how many people here finnished the game but I really wanna talk more about that main story because it's just so good, so spoilers :

Spoiler: show

Man the story really took me by surprise especially because of the start of the game it's this really run of the mill "character that is an outsider has to prove itself" kinda of thing and it also starts with a trope Im hating in games that's the father-daughter relationship with a guy that might as well have "dead mentor" written on his forehead because that's how fast you figure out that he's gonna die. But I loved when in reality her character story wasnt about her relationship with Rost but it was about a mother and daughter relationship or the lack of one that's what really drives Alloys entire character through the game and what a great way to tie your character story with the main plot in a way that doesnt feel gratuitus,Alloy is the "chosen one" in this story but it's for a very good reason.

Those arent the only ways that the story surprises you in a kinda of bait and switch manner, I mean when I started the game I thought that the cause of the apocalipse would be your run of the mill "mankind created robots and they revolted against them ending civilization" but they gave it a great twist to it it wasnt a case of Skynet becaming self-aware and deciding to destroy humanity it was a glitch that made them out of control making them just mindlessly destroy the earth, that's actually way more interesting and (scarily)possible then your avarege robot apocalypse scenario I also loved that despite all the work that went into Gaia she still acts like a machine it doesnt have real inteligence the way you'd think of it and the same goes for Hades he didnt decide that humanity wasnt worth living or something like that it was simply following it's programing. The whole idea of Zero Dawn and the fall of mankind was so interesting to me I dont think I'ver ever seen anything quite like in any medium really, the closest I can think of it's Interstellar and that has a whole deus ex machina happy ending, this was really original and it all made sense even the part of the robot dinosaurs that never expected to get an good explanation.

I also liked how this great sci-fi story was within this more "classic" fantasy story of the unearthing of a dark lord that treathens the world and the birth of a choosen one to fight him, it was pretty neat but it also highlights the problem of the present day characters I mean I was way more interested in what was gonna happen to the dead characters like Elizabet,Ted Faro and the alphas then I ever was about any of the living ones with the execption of Alloy and Sylens(love that guy btw)and that's a problem, I think many of them have potential like Avad and that cool woman that you meet in sunfall but they dont have much to them, Avad is a good king that wants to reform the Carja and that's it and that girl is quirk and funny but that's it, none of them have much complexity. I really hope though that in the sequel they dont simply dump this cast of characters and put Alloy in another setting, I want these characters back so they can be properly developed and I think now that this first game focused alot on the past the sequel can afford to focus more on the present, I really hope they do a Fallout 2 where it's a mixture of new areas and old but with the old ones changed and developed more. One of the little things I loved was how all the tribal religions were in their own way right about how their world was created, how the Nora have the all mother that gave life and destroyed the robots in reference to Gaia, how the carja see the world in cycles also in reference to the cycle of Gaia and Hades, how the Oseram myth is about how humans werent good stewards of the machines and how the world was created by a machine,etc. It's really cool I really think they did a great job creating these cultures,hell even all the metal they wear on their clothes makes sense if you consider there's not really large wildlife only machines, really outstanding.

One last thing though is that I think there was abit too much datalogs, I'd much rather have far fewer but for them to be better, alot of it is good but I think they could've trimmed the fat a little bit on that. Also this game made me realize Im really fucking tired of the whole Bioware camera angle when talking to characters, I dont know why it especifically bothered me here but I really hope RPGs or any game that uses dialogue systems find a way to move past that.

[JaySevenZero]

So, since I've seen a similar technique used to make videos before, I figured I'd play around with HZD's excellent photo mode to make a short little video instead of just using it to take stills.

[countstex]

Jay, you're documentary-esque photos and now videos are an inspiration!

[JaySevenZero]

Thanks bud!

[DomsBeard]

I'm level 30 and I've not even met one of them yet!. Great video

[Whippledip]

I've seen some folks being negative towards the character animation in HZD, to which I couldn't disagree more with them, especially after I sat and watched a couple of hours of Mass Effect: Andromeda gameplay. Anyway, here's a collected sample of only a handful of characters that you'll come across on your travels in the game and I'll challenge anyone to tell me that they're badly done.*

*should be relatively spoiler free too!

It's like sometimes they completely drop the ball with the facial animation, the infamous section at the beginning with the dude who hears voices in his head, and basically any time someone shows their teeth smiling are examples of when it doesn't work. Essentially the meatier the characters' role in the story is, the more care goes in to the animation.

The biggest problem is how incongruous the body animations are compared to the subtle changes in the faces. It looks a little silly when they're swinging their arms around like a carnival barker and their head is constantly jerking around.

That said, Aloy's animations are fantastic across the board

[Flabyo]

I've noticed that the facial animation occasionally goes out of sync with the audio, but that's about the only issue I have with it. The nuance of expression is pretty damned impressive.

The quality of the writing helps of course, you can have the best face tech in the world but if the words you have them say are dumb it doesn't matter. Here the writing is superb. I'm particularly fond of the way the Carja (the sun worshipping tribe) work so much daylight/sunset/shadow/rising etc... idioms into their figures of speech without any of it feeling forced. That takes skilled craft to get right.

[Bakers_12]

There is simualr stuff with the Nora too

Spoiler: show

some of the Nora culture and idioms used are explained in the holovids later in the game where they are used in a different context e.g. The children in the bunker being told "to be brave" being a precursor to the braves of the Nora tribe

[DomsBeard]

So just finished it now. What a game.

Has anyone played afterwards to mop up all the collectables?. Think I've done most of the side quests and sit at 70% completed.

Trying to decide if new game + or carrying on with the same save is the best way going forward.

[macstat]

I'm still playing through it and I'm having a blast. That said I have a couple of issues with this game and with its perception.But let's start with good things

The setting is HZD probably strongest point. For most of the game instead uncovering the mystery behind humanity downfall you tend to get accustomed with how humans live now. You learn about their customs, religion, how they hunt and go about their everyday life. I think this is very good approach since something that we don't get a lot in video games. On the other hand, we had a lot of "end of days" type scenarios and im afraid it wouldn't be as unique.

Story from what I saw is fairly interesting, though it's not Citizen Kane. It keeps me in the game and gives me interesting tidbits of lore. The main character is also good since its an action game it's understandable that we get "Ezio Auditore" level of character development. Secondary characters, on the other hand, aren't very interesting. I got somewhat interested in maybe two characters, rest of them, unfortunately, felt like a stock person added to a game.

Combat is fun, I like this coherent marriage of spear, bow and stealth mechanics. All of those options feel powerful and you can play the way you prefer for most of the game (besides occasional boss fights that you need to take like a man ... oh pardon . There is one thing that annoyed me to no end. Aiming in combat, especially when fighting those damn birds can be a handful (i would definitely prefer to play this game on PC with a proper mouse). Aloy also occasionally got tangled in some roots, rocks etc which can result in death so better collisions in situations when you can't scan your surrounding very fast would be great.

Another issue which might sound like a minor thing but annoyed me very much is lack of "sleep till nightfall/sunrise" option. Why is that such a big deal? Well, my TV room is positioned so that for most of the day i get sun just outside my window. So when ingame night started I often couldn't see much, I strained my eyes trying to see anything and in general, it was a bad experience. This is why such trivial option should be in the game like this.

My next point is not an issue for me, but I felt its necessary to point out since in this world where it's trendy to bash on Ubisoft games people fell in love with HZD. This game in most of its core mechanics is a marriage of assassins creed and far cry primal. I've been hearing a lot how this game is better than "stock Ubisoft open-world game" but it's not. It's roughly the same experience for most of the game. You have towers to climb, you have crafting that is identical to Far Cry one. Combat might feel unique but it is essentially Far Cry combat with Assassins Creed camera perspective.

I also have something that is not a complaint but rather a let down. Its how traversing and climbing were done in this game. It's again stock open-world type of "here you have a special color of rock that you can grab" or in this case yellow lines/bars etc (and white rocks ). I'm still waiting for someone to do something more with exploration aspect of OW games. It looks great but its very shallow.

Oh ... animations are top notch. I haven't seen anything bad and those sawtooths lunging at you ..... it's so gorgeous. Some not important NPCs were less detailed than Aloy but that's how it all is done (Witcher does the same thing) since it would be a huge time investment to make everybody as polished as your main protagonist.

Overall I think this game is great, it does a lot of things good or amazing. At the same time, it's not a revolution but rather an evolution. A well polished open world game with a unique setting.

[James]

My next point is not an issue for me, but I felt its necessary to point out since in this world where it's trendy to bash on Ubisoft games people fell in love with HZD. This game in most of its core mechanics is a marriage of assassins creed and far cry primal. I've been hearing a lot how this game is better than "stock Ubisoft open-world game" but it's not. It's roughly the same experience for most of the game. You have towers to climb, you have crafting that is identical to Far Cry one. Combat might feel unique but it is essentially Far Cry combat with Assassins Creed camera perspective.

This is pretty much what I feared from what was said about the game around release, and what I'd seen in pre-release stuff. Alongside the overwhelming, glowing praise, it sounded like HZD was cribbing from a bunch of games that I'd ceased to enjoy some years ago.

Nothing wrong with iterating and bringing together ideas to form something new, of course, but every ingredient mentioned put me off more and more. I imagine I'll try it out at some point, but rest assured, you're not alone in scratching your head at why what's tired and old for Ubisoft is just dandy for Guerilla.

[Flabyo]

It’s the Blizzard thing basically. It’s not really doing anything new, but it’s doing it all much better than the competition does. The world building here is better, the combat is better, the animation is better, the writing is way better (Farcry 3’s writing? Oof).

But if you don’t like this design pattern, then you’re not going to like HZD.

I think I said it some thread else, but HZD is the pinnacle of an old design, Breath of the Wild is the beginnings of a better one.

[James]

Completely agree re. Far Cry 3. It aggressively put me off the series, but also shone a light on where Ubisoft were headed with several of their series, design-wise. It's certainly not a single-studio template though, and that's part of the problem for me. Shadow Of Mordor was the same, but with the Nemesis System. inFAMOUS, Batman Arkham, Tomb Raider,... Be it convergent evolution or something more intentional, the list of games with significant design overlap goes on.

That HZD polishes the template to within an inch of its life is commendable, but I wasn't thrilled at the idea of playing it before I played Breath Of The Wild, and I'm struggling to find the motivation afterwards.

To be clear, this absolutely isn't a criticism of the game, just a venting of my own feelings and mindset. I'm sure I'm not alone, but I also know that many, many (millions of) people continue to enjoy Assassin's Creed and, indeed, loved HZD. I've seen HZD compared favourably to Breath Of The Wild, and I get that too, but you summed up my feelings pretty well in that Zelda has taken a step in a direction that interests me so much more than HZD and its progenitors.