Furi

This is where you can deliberate anything relating to videogames - past, present and future
Post Reply
User avatar
JaySevenZero
Admin
Posts: 2643
Joined: August 27th, 2012, 4:28 pm
Location: Liverpool, Europe, Earth
Contact:

Furi

Post by JaySevenZero »

Here's where you can contribute your memories and opinions of Furi for potential inclusion in the forthcoming podcast.

Friendly reminder to all that where feedback for the podcast is concerned, we love it - but self-editing (brevity) is appreciated. We do want to include a breadth of opinions where appropriate, but no-one wants a discussion podcast that’s mainly reading. Better to save yourself time and cut to the chase if you can.
User avatar
Alex79
Member
Posts: 8423
Joined: September 2nd, 2012, 12:36 pm
Location: Walsall, UK.
Contact:

Re: 374: Furi

Post by Alex79 »

I thought I'd make a real effort, after two abandoned attempts at this game, to finish it for the show.

Here's my one piece of advice to anyone playing this game, and I genuinely think it's an important lesson:

Give up.

Then start again on Easy mode.

The normal mode is pointlessly and artificially difficult. The bosses have more energy and you do much less damage. Its just not enjoyable. I've played and finished plenty of 'hard' games, but these is something else! It's not fun!

Easy is where all the cool kids are at, and there's plenty of room on this bus. Jump on, and enjoy the game, because it really is a fantastic game. On easy.
User avatar
Alex79
Member
Posts: 8423
Joined: September 2nd, 2012, 12:36 pm
Location: Walsall, UK.
Contact:

Re: 374: Furi

Post by Alex79 »

The game really does belittle you for picking the easier mode, several times. I found this to be quite mean-spirited, and actually made me have less respect for the developers. OK, made a hard game, that's fine. Don't shame people who want to play it on an easier setting. Now this is far from the only game to ever do this, but it's the tone and the way it goes about it. Pfft.
User avatar
KSubzero1000
Member
Posts: 3365
Joined: August 26th, 2015, 9:56 pm
Location: Germany

Re: 374: Furi

Post by KSubzero1000 »

I think it's also worth mentioning that easy mode doesn't just re-adjust the damage modifiers a bit, but also completely removes certain boss phases. Which is a significant change in a game that is basically all boss fights.
User avatar
Alex79
Member
Posts: 8423
Joined: September 2nd, 2012, 12:36 pm
Location: Walsall, UK.
Contact:

Re: 374: Furi

Post by Alex79 »

Ah really? I didn't notice that. That's annoying. No trophies, either. This'll make for a very interesting show, I think. Can't wait to hear how the team get on with it. I'm going to finish on easy then maybe have another try on normal (I have got to the 4th or 5th boss on normal before now).
User avatar
MajorGamer
Member
Posts: 135
Joined: October 14th, 2016, 6:33 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Re: 374: Furi

Post by MajorGamer »

I'm curious as to why you say the game is artificially difficult. I only beat it a few months ago (Furier Mode included) and didn't get that impression at all.
User avatar
Alex79
Member
Posts: 8423
Joined: September 2nd, 2012, 12:36 pm
Location: Walsall, UK.
Contact:

Re: 374: Furi

Post by Alex79 »

I don't really think I worded it right to be honest. I just mean it doesn't seem like you need to be more skillful necessarily to beat the bosses, more than they just seemed to have more energy and you do less damage.

What I mean is, say if in Street Fighter 2 or whatever, on the hardest difficulty the AI opponents behaved in exactly the same way as on one star difficulty, they just had six times the energy they did on easy. So the game isn't harder so much as it just takes longer to beat (and therefore leaves more time for you to get beat).

Not sure if that's explains better what I meant, I fear it might not!
User avatar
MajorGamer
Member
Posts: 135
Joined: October 14th, 2016, 6:33 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Re: 374: Furi

Post by MajorGamer »

The takeaway I got from that is that you are saying the bosses have too much HP. It is a fine line to tread to get it right. There are some that are too low like some Mega Man bosses that die in a couple hits or too high like Unknown difficulty in Tales of the Abyss having some take over an hour. With Furi, most will fall in about 5 minutes, though learning their patterns in each phase to get to that point will take longer. Either way, good luck with it if you do continue.

Tangent: It amused me that you randomly used Street Fighter 2 for an example since it is the only non-Smash fighting game I have.
User avatar
shadowless_kick
Member
Posts: 116
Joined: May 1st, 2018, 12:16 am

Re: 374: Furi

Post by shadowless_kick »

LOOKS
Furi has a great look. I love the color scheme and the relatively flat, stylized presentation. The character designs are unique and hit a sweet spot that shouldn't seem to exist between wacky and deadly serious. The visuals really shine in the environments during the walking scenes between fights, which is why I wasn’t bothered by them like some others were. (I took so many screenshots during those sections.)

SOUNDS
This game gets a lot of deserved attention for its soundtrack, but I wanna tip my hat to the voice actors. Even when hearing the same handful of phrases over and over within a fight, I never got tired of them. I especially enjoyed the tortured threats of the sewer guy and I’ve developed a light crush on the sniper and that sexy accent of hers.

GAMEPLAY/SYSTEMS
The way the health system works by resetting an energy level whenever you or the CPU gets a “point” I found to be clever, but it can lead to lots of frustrating and tedious replays, particularly when you’re only having trouble with the final phase of an attack wave. Of course the difficulty needs to ramp up as the battle progresses, but more fluidity between patterns rather than stark transitions could’ve helped to keep things more interesting.

Unfortunately, I’ve never gotten the “good” ending as I found the final final battle with your former boss to feel quite foreign compared to the rest of the game. It’s like I’m suddenly controlling a different, far less responsive character from a different title altogether. The fight also suffers from one of my big pet peeves which is no audio feedback when dealing damage. The entire battle feels like a rough demo and simply isn’t fun to play. I gave up.

IN SHORT...
On the whole, I enjoyed my initial playthrough on the "Furi" setting, but it was hard not to be disappointed: on paper, Furi's combination of shump bullet dodging and melee combat is my dream game. But when it was over, I didn’t have a strong urge to dig deeper or shoot for better times or trophies. When revisiting it for this podcast, that feeling of “one and done” was only reinforced—although, it was interesting to encounter each opponent again while already knowing the truth about the protagonist.

Ultimately, I think Furi has a solid foundation that needed another round or two of tweaking and polish to turn into something really memorable. Still, I would recommend anyone interested to give it a try; it isn't perfect, but it does some unique things and offers a mostly fun, if fleeting, experience.
User avatar
seansthomas
Member
Posts: 856
Joined: March 31st, 2015, 8:10 am

Re: 374: Furi

Post by seansthomas »

I'm trying to beat this in time for the podcast but am struggling to. Playing on Furi mode. At the Old Man fight and can consistently get to phase 3 or 4 but then I can't figure out the pattern.

Maybe it's because I've played Dead cells, Dark Souls and Breath of the Wild in the past 6 months but after those, these encounters feel very flat.

Loved the tutorial level and thought it would be great but not hitting the spot for me. Worth restarting on Easy to see the story through?
User avatar
shadowless_kick
Member
Posts: 116
Joined: May 1st, 2018, 12:16 am

Re: 374: Furi

Post by shadowless_kick »

I'd say yes — the story does some interesting things. if you can get through it without sacrificing too much time, give it another crack on easy.

also, keep in mind that some of the later boss patterns are impenetrable; you simply need to survive long enough until they drop their guard...
User avatar
Jobobonobo
Member
Posts: 574
Joined: July 27th, 2016, 4:30 pm

Re: 374: Furi

Post by Jobobonobo »

I am unsure if other people would classify Furi as a Souls type game but for me it is certainly the closest I have ever gotten to experiencing one. While these games have an incredibly passionate fanbase, their difficult reputation was always something that put me off from playing them as I just do not have the patience and time anymore to “git gud”. But the art style and boss rush gameplay of Furi did appeal to me so I decided to give it a shot. And I can certainly see why Souls fans enjoy this type of gameplay so much. The feeling of figuring out a boss pattern and knowing when to parry, dodge and attack can be sublimely satisfying. I died a lot but each time I was learning something new.

And then I hit a massive road block.

As pathetic as it sounds it was Boss no. 4, the Scale that did me in. At the beginning I was improving slowly, learning the patterns and reacting accordingly. I was at the stage that most of his phases I could blaze through, no problem. But the final phase is just cheap BS and made me realise that the dodge mechanic has a slight delay that makes avoiding his avalanche of shockwaves incredibly difficult. I would either hit it too late when I thought I had good timing or I would dodge one only to smack right into one of his energy barriers. Not to mention when you get hit by either barrier or shockwave you fall down and recovering from such attacks takes so long that when you are ready to fight again another shockwave will knock you straight over again! Unlike his other phases, I was not improving, not slightly. I always died at the same moment. Again and again no improvement. Add to the fact that he never shuts the hell up and I was seriously contemplating deleting this game altogether.

Instead I went and switched to easy mode. It might not have been very “hardcore” of me but I was just not enjoying myself anymore. And the game did become a lot more enjoyable to me. I was still dying a fair bit but now I was back at mastering the boss and figuring out what made them tick. But I could not shake the feeling of being unsatisfied with breezing through the game when before I really had to struggle. I also know that if I went back to normal difficulty I would be back to seething at the screen muttering swears under my breath so this was a real Catch 22 of a situation.

Ultimately, Furi was legitimately enjoying when I understood the mechanics of a boss fight and how to use them to my advantage but when it starting pulling cheap tricks I went into straight up antipathy towards the title. Coupled with the strange sense of disappointment I felt when switching to easy mode I felt not triumph when finishing this game but merely “meh”. I find it hard to recommend this game but I cannot say to avoid at all costs either. Most certainly an acquired taste which really tests your tolerance for repetition and cheapness.

Three word review: Not for everybody
User avatar
Scrustle
Member
Posts: 2426
Joined: November 18th, 2012, 6:02 pm

Re: 374: Furi

Post by Scrustle »

(Not sure if you will want to use this for the pod, but I thought I'd pitch in anyway. Usually I like to contribute to stuff that I really care about, but in this case this is a game I'm not that invested in, so I don't have a huge amount to say on it. It was also a very long time since I last played it.)

I really wanted to like Furi, but there was just too much about it that I really didn't gel with that made it impossible for me to enjoy. There were things about it I really liked though. The visual style is fantastic, especially for me being a fan of Afro Samurai, the creator of which did the character design here. The soundtrack is brilliant, and I'm a big fan of many games this one takes after.

But unfortunately, this is a game of two halves, and what joy I got from one was quashed by the other. I really liked the melee sections of the boss fights, where you go toe-to-toe in the really snappy, quick, and stylish duels. But the bullet hell sections were just awful for me. I'm not in to that kind of game at all and have more or less zero experience with them. There was just too much on screen for me to deal with, and the size of the hitbox for your character and the bullets themselves always felt really inconsistent and unreliable. And despite the gameplay being split 50/50 between these modes, my imbalance of skills meant my experience with the game meant having to spend far more time on the parts I wasn't enjoying. In at least the short time that I did play, I found the sword fighting sections to go rather smoothly, while every bullet hell phase was a slog and a huge barrier that was a struggle to get past. I quickly reached a point where I just couldn't progress anymore.

And despite mostly enjoying the close-quarters phases, I did have some problems with how the controls work in those sections too. Because you can either press or hold every action you can do in order to charge it up, actions happen when you release the button, not when you hit it. It made the controls feel like they were always a half-beat behind what you want them to be. That wasn't a huge problem for most commands, except for the dodge. Never felt like I could rely on it. I always felt like this was a problem that could have been fixed too, given how you have two buttons mapped for each action, to free your thumb up for aiming in the bullet hell phases. Why not make one of the two buttons for each action have instant activation only? Or at least let the player choose to have that. It has been a very long time since I've played the game however. Maybe some of my problems have been fixed by now.
Tbone254
Member
Posts: 30
Joined: May 11th, 2017, 2:00 am

Re: 374: Furi

Post by Tbone254 »

Prior to receiving Furi for free through Playstation Plus, I had never heard of it. It turned into my surprise favorite game of 2016. I gave it a shot after seeing the artwork’s resemblance to Afro Samurai. I’m glad I did. Furi’s frenetic combat was just the kick in the pants I needed to get me out of my Soulsborne rut. (Not a bad rut, but a rut just the same).

Apparently the game’s difficulty became a bit of a hot topic amongst the gaming community, with many people citing it as a game the is overly difficult or difficult in the wrong ways. This surprised me. I thought the game was very difficult but also fair. The controls are tight and responsive. The only real criticism I can think of is that the game doesn’t do a very good job of explaining all the details of the combats. I recently watched a Let’s Play of the tutorial fight, and I didn’t notice any prompts stating that you could deflect projectiles back at enemies, charge your sword for extra damage, or charge your dodge for a further dodge distance (which is also responsible for the infamous laggy dodge mechanic as the dodge initiates on release of the button instead of the initial press). There is also no mention of the alternate controls that allow for dodging with the shoulder buttons. So I guess I can see where some people had some trouble understanding the mechanics, but with a little experimenting these things aren’t too hard to find.

The story was a surprise for me. It’s acted well, subtly told, and asks some morally challenging questions. This last part is exemplified by the final guardian, The Beat. This boss’s narrative section really caught me off guard. The Beat is a perfect example of how younger generations can be influenced by older generations, and how they can take up ideals that they may not fully understand. The tone of The Voice is different here. He talks about how his hate for the prison is rooted with this final guardian. You can hear the disgust and frustration in his voice when he talks about the people’s willingness to sacrifice her for their safety. This gives us some insight in his decision to break out of the prison he created. Especially when we find out it is to see his daughter again. Even the tone of the battle is different. Rather than taunt Rider, she tries to reason with him. And when Rider finally reaches the final platform and The Beat can retreat no further, she begs him to turn back. Since she has no ability to fight, all she does is block while Rider mercilessly pummels her. The sheer brutality of it caught me off guard. When he finally kills her, she begs him to stay one last time before finally slumping down to her knees, looking helplessly pathetic and alone. This was a straight up sucker punch in the feels. I was not prepared for this. Then to further send my emotions on the fritz, the next scene is the credits that has Rider walking around an open field as the world withers and decays at his feet. All set to some of the most awesome and funky music I’ve ever heard. In total contrast to my feelings just moments ago, I felt like a total badass. I was free because I was willing to do whatever was necessary. It was one of the most emotionally exhilarating moments in gaming for me.

I don’t believe there are perfect games, as there is always room for improvement. However, I believe Furi is exactly the game it wants to be, which is about as close to perfect as you can get.
User avatar
Simonsloth
Member
Posts: 1639
Joined: November 22nd, 2017, 7:17 am
Location: London
Contact:

Re: 374: Furi

Post by Simonsloth »

If I were to distill Furi down to its separate components visuals, audio and gameplay then two of those parts are in my opinion incredible.

The visual aesthetic is wonderful and appeals directly to my tastes after all the character design was by Takashi Okazaki the creator of Afro Samurai.

The soundtrack and sound design reached heights which I have not experienced since Hotline Miami and were a compelling reason alone for me to wait to see the game through to its climax.

The gameplay is where the game left me wanting. I would rate my overall gaming prowess as average at best and Furi demanded too much from me. My main sticking point was the dash feature which has a slight delay. As the difficulty cranked up I found increasingly that despite multiple retires I just couldn’t reliably dodge projectiles or attacks using it. After a huge number of failed attempts I opted to use promenade mode.

At first this mode was so easy as to sap any excitement or challenge the game has to offer and I thought I had made a mistake. However as the game reached its denouement even on this easier mode the challenge ramped up quickly.

It is in the moments when the screen is full of projectiles which you impossibly dodge through with a slither of health to your name whilst the deliciously curated soundtrack assaults your senses that the game truly clicks. The dash delay made these moments less frequent than I hoped but I just could not master it. The lovers of this game obviously have and I have nothing but envy for them. A missed opportunity but it’s my fault not Furi’s.
User avatar
Alex79
Member
Posts: 8423
Joined: September 2nd, 2012, 12:36 pm
Location: Walsall, UK.
Contact:

Re: 374: Furi

Post by Alex79 »

Tbone254 wrote: May 20th, 2019, 12:33 am The only real criticism I can think of is that the game doesn’t do a very good job of explaining all the details of the combats. I recently watched a Let’s Play of the tutorial fight, and I didn’t notice any prompts stating that you could deflect projectiles back at enemies, charge your sword for extra damage, or charge your dodge for a further dodge distance (which is also responsible for the infamous laggy dodge mechanic as the dodge initiates on release of the button instead of the initial press). There is also no mention of the alternate controls that allow for dodging with the shoulder buttons. So I guess I can see where some people had some trouble understanding the mechanics, but with a little experimenting these things aren’t too hard to find.
I don't remember if they do tell you during the game itself, but all those things are explained in one of the menus, maybe under controls? There are videos of all the moves and stuff you can do.
Tbone254
Member
Posts: 30
Joined: May 11th, 2017, 2:00 am

Re: 374: Furi

Post by Tbone254 »

Alex79uk wrote: June 1st, 2019, 12:39 pm
Tbone254 wrote: May 20th, 2019, 12:33 am The only real criticism I can think of is that the game doesn’t do a very good job of explaining all the details of the combats. I recently watched a Let’s Play of the tutorial fight, and I didn’t notice any prompts stating that you could deflect projectiles back at enemies, charge your sword for extra damage, or charge your dodge for a further dodge distance (which is also responsible for the infamous laggy dodge mechanic as the dodge initiates on release of the button instead of the initial press). There is also no mention of the alternate controls that allow for dodging with the shoulder buttons. So I guess I can see where some people had some trouble understanding the mechanics, but with a little experimenting these things aren’t too hard to find.
I don't remember if they do tell you during the game itself, but all those things are explained in one of the menus, maybe under controls? There are videos of all the moves and stuff you can do.
I hopped back on to check it out. Sure enough, the videos are there but if you don't go digging through the menu you'll never find them, which was my biggest issue with the game. I am sure I am not the only one that didn't find the tutorial videos and I typically spend some time in the menu. So more information during the game would have been nice. Maybe the developers felt they couldn't incorporate instructions for all the different actions within the game naturally, which is fine. I was just saying that I think that the some of the controls weren't as intuitive as some may have liked. Though there is something to be said about discovering mechanics that aren't always obvious, I'm just not used to experiencing that in a game like this. I love this game. I just try to find a critical point about a game when I post here. There's always room for improvement!
User avatar
MajorGamer
Member
Posts: 135
Joined: October 14th, 2016, 6:33 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Re: Our next podcast recording (16.6.19) - 374: Furi

Post by MajorGamer »

The difficulty is a big point for this game and one that I think it did perfectly. Fully clearing a boss phase restores a life so you'll always get at least two attempts at each phase. Most boss phases have a long range and short range sections that are clearly marked to set you up for what to expect. For long range, you are dodging around the bullet hell that gets thrown your way along with the occasional melee. For the short range, you are parrying their onslaught of melee attacks and sweeps. Everything here is telegraphed to some extent so you can quickly react to the pattern they are in to avoid taking damage and counter attacking when available. The parry mechanic is a great tool here; letting you send back projectiles to the boss or stopping the direct melee hits. As a bonus, parrying restores some of your own HP to help get you through. Dodging is needed for the shockwave and sweep attacks but it takes some getting used to since you only dodge when releasing the button, not pressing it. This is because you can charge your dodge, affecting how far you go. On Furi difficulty, this is helpful and never necessary but on Furier difficulty, it becomes mandatory to avoid those hits.

I love how the harder difficulty is done. The damage bosses do is the same throughout but their patterns change. The changes they get keeps the style of each boss but the extra, faster, and more complex patterns really makes things intense. As an example, taking out The Scale on Furier took me more attempts than all of Furi combined. And it was glorious. If the normal game is too hard, they released a patch recently that lets you further tweak things in an almost Celeste fashion so everyone should be able to find something they can get through.

The story has nice little touches to it, some of which can only be picked up on in a repeated playthrough. The Strap is who the prison was originally built for. The Scale (and the DLC boss, The Flame) met The Rider previously with disastrous results. The Voice is the one who built the prison and wants out, even faking a fight in what would have been his own arena. Then there is The Beat who is there out of duty, not ability, and the point where you may really question if you are the bad guy. This immediately gets followed by your escape causing the decay of everything around you leading to the potential confrontation with The Star. It all makes for some nice world building in a boss rush game where it wasn't particularly necessary to have.
Post Reply