The Nintendo news and discussion thread

This is where you can deliberate anything relating to videogames - past, present and future.
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ratsoalbion
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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by ratsoalbion » July 10th, 2019, 1:24 pm

It’s an absolute fallacy that Nintendo deliberately shut itself off from selling SNES ROMs at £8 to the massive 3DS install base for the sake of selling a few extra N3DS units to the few who people were desperate to access the library of 12 or so (if that) SNES games that were released on N3DS VC.

They genuinely weren’t satisfied with the emulation on base 3DS. I have this on very good authority.

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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by Stanshall » July 10th, 2019, 1:24 pm

Not personally interested in a handheld only system because the Satisfye grip is too good, anyway. I never ever use the Switch 'naked'. That said, I'm sure this will sell like shit off a shovel. This paired with a new Pokemon is going to be an amazing Christmas present and a way of getting more kids in with a less expensive and maybe slightly hardier console.

On that note, as great as the original system is, it's probably the most fragile, fiddly and creaky Nintendo hardware I've personally ever used. All the little flaps and the ever so slightly loose Joycons and the ugly and unergonomic rails and stuff. It's ingenious and it works but it's hardly Apple in either aesthetics or functionality. Compared to the DS Lite or 3DS, it's pretty average. The dock as well is pretty chunky and ugly and cheap. It's a strange product purely from a visual and functional design perspective and yet it's my favourite console ever. What it needs to do, it does extremely well.

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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by ratsoalbion » July 10th, 2019, 1:31 pm

I mean, the launch DS was certainly sturdy, but aesthetically that was the most ‘still in prototype’ piece of kit I can remember anyone releasing.

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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by KSubzero1000 » July 10th, 2019, 1:33 pm

ratsoalbion wrote:
July 10th, 2019, 1:24 pm
They genuinely weren’t satisfied with the emulation on base 3DS. I have this on very good authority.
Well I'm not going to question your source, but it does leave me wonder about what exactly went so wrong on the technical side of things. The NDS and even the GBA had some perfectly serviceable ports of SNES games that played very well (Chrono Trigger, LttP), so I'm puzzled as to why the 3DS was deemed insufficient in that regard. Although maybe it's easier to port individual games and optimize them as necessary.

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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by ratsoalbion » July 10th, 2019, 1:47 pm

I expect it would have been possible with a certain amount of investment to optimise the emulator, and/or individual games, but for whatever (business) reason they didn’t think it was worth it.

Emulation is a very different proposition to conversion (Chrono Trigger was DS rather than GBA btw, but still), and having played SNES games on a hacked PSP (which was a more capable machine than 3DS in many ways, despite being older) I can attest to some serious frame rate issues on certain titles.

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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by Stanshall » July 10th, 2019, 1:47 pm

ratsoalbion wrote:
July 10th, 2019, 1:31 pm
I mean, the launch DS was certainly sturdy, but aesthetically that was the most ‘still in prototype’ piece of kit I can remember anyone releasing.
That's a good one. I only ever used the original DS for about five minutes but I remember thinking it was remarkably shit. Amazing how refined and frankly beautiful the DS Lite was, in comparison. My black DS Lite is probably my favourite ever product from a pure design point of view. Absolutely stunning.

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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by Alex79uk » July 10th, 2019, 1:49 pm

@ksub: They were ports though, not emulation, which is an entirely different thing.

Having said that, I had a SNES emulator on my launch DS which ran games perfectly acceptably.

@ratso: Yeah SNES emulation was never great on PSP until fairly recently, where its now pretty flawless. Either way, I am very doubtful the Switch would struggle.

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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by hazeredmist » July 10th, 2019, 1:50 pm

KSubzero1000 wrote:
July 10th, 2019, 1:33 pm
ratsoalbion wrote:
July 10th, 2019, 1:24 pm
They genuinely weren’t satisfied with the emulation on base 3DS. I have this on very good authority.
Well I'm not going to question your source, but it does leave me wonder about what exactly went so wrong on the technical side of things. The NDS and even the GBA had some perfectly serviceable ports of SNES games that played very well (Chrono Trigger, LttP), so I'm puzzled as to why the 3DS was deemed insufficient in that regard. Although maybe it's easier to port individual games and optimize them as necessary.
Agreed, I simply don't believe that it was impossible to get SNES emulation to an acceptable standard on 3DS hardware. Perhaps they gave up on it as not being financially viable to continue which would be understandable, but incapable? Hmm.

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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by hazeredmist » July 10th, 2019, 1:51 pm

ratsoalbion wrote:
July 10th, 2019, 1:31 pm
I mean, the launch DS was certainly sturdy, but aesthetically that was the most ‘still in prototype’ piece of kit I can remember anyone releasing.
It was hideous!

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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by ratsoalbion » July 10th, 2019, 1:56 pm

I’m not suggesting for one moment that the Switch can’t run SNES games btw, but it is true that as it stood, the base 3DS was not up to snuff as far as Nintendo was concerned. Same reasons as GBA games were only ever released kinda cobbled together for ‘ambassadors’.

No doubt people would have been on their backs soon enough had they released sub-par VC titles - in fact, they were in regards to the washed-out visuals and latency of some Wii U VC games!

There are loads of other ways to play SNES games though, right now..!

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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by hazeredmist » July 10th, 2019, 1:58 pm

Stanshall wrote:
July 10th, 2019, 1:24 pm
On that note, as great as the original system is, it's probably the most fragile, fiddly and creaky Nintendo hardware I've personally ever used. All the little flaps and the ever so slightly loose Joycons and the ugly and unergonomic rails and stuff. It's ingenious and it works but it's hardly Apple in either aesthetics or functionality. Compared to the DS Lite or 3DS, it's pretty average. The dock as well is pretty chunky and ugly and cheap. It's a strange product purely from a visual and functional design perspective and yet it's my favourite console ever. What it needs to do, it does extremely well.
Agreed... Only using the Satisfye allowed me to relax without feeling like the Switch would snap apart in my hands. I don't like the kickstand either, it's terrible. It's placed so poorly and your finger can sometimes nudge it out as it's so flimsily held in place. Yeuch. You really shouldn't need to buy an expensive peripheral to make your expensive console comfortable to use.

I'd go so far as to say that build quality wise, Nintendo are actually quite overrated:

- GBA - dodgy battery cover
- DS - dodgy hinges
- N64 - analogue sticks pretty much guaranteed to be fucked / severely degraded after a while
- 3DS - creaky / buttons inexplicably make permanent impressions on the casing above, even on the New 3DS (wtf)
- Switch - aforementioned build issues. To me, HD rumble is also irritating, it feels like a shit phone vibration, awful in the hands. I have had it disabled pretty much the whole time I've had the Switch, and every time I test it out again, it quickly annoys and goes back off.

I quite like the Wii U Gamepad as a more solid device, although others criticised that.

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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by Suits » July 10th, 2019, 2:11 pm

Sweet.

A cheaper, slightly smaller Switch that will be available as an option to buy if that’s what you feel like you need.

Great colours too, they look lovely.

Like every Nintendo handheld before it, I expect this revision to have better build quality and ergonomics. The round edges on the Switch Lite look gooood.

Not needing to have the requirement of the primary controls and handles to be interchangeable will make it feel a lot sturdier too.

The biggest bad point I can see so far is the fact there is no way to connect it to the TV either out of the box or with additional peripherals later on.

I also very much approve of the ‘Lite’ name coming back, as the DS Lite is one of the best looking and feeling handhelds I can think of.

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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by ratsoalbion » July 10th, 2019, 2:15 pm

I can only assume other people treat their hardware like shite!
😆

My N64 analogues never broke, my GBAs are both still near perfect, as is my GameCube, my SNES and N64 were both still in tip-top shape when I sold them, my N3DS XL is pristine bar a few touchscreen scratches.

I’m not going to argue about the Switch’s kickstand, but I’ve not had a problem with any other aspect of it (although admittedly I use it docked 95% of the time).

I really like the d-pad and the colours of the Lite, but I have no need for one whatsoever.

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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by KSubzero1000 » July 10th, 2019, 2:18 pm

Suits wrote:
July 10th, 2019, 2:11 pm
The biggest bad point I can see so far is the fact there is no way to connect it to the TV either out of the box or with additional peripherals later on.
Yeah, not even putting in an HDMI port is a bold design decision - this is very much a handheld through and through. One other potential drawback would be compatibility issues with some of the games that have been designed around the detachable joycons.

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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by Suits » July 10th, 2019, 2:21 pm

KSubzero1000 wrote:
July 10th, 2019, 2:18 pm
One other potential drawback would be compatibility issues with some of the games that have been designed around the detachable joycons.


Yeah, 1-2 Switch & Snipperclips are the two that spring to mind.

There are ways to play games like Arms via traditional controllers, so I wonder if the games that don’t - will get patched !?

Also, I’ve not seen any mention of gyroscopic input, but it clearly shows games like Splatoon and BotW being played - but then again, those games have the options to remove that input.

As a fan of gyroscopic input, I hope it’s in there.

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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by KSubzero1000 » July 10th, 2019, 2:24 pm

Suits wrote:
July 10th, 2019, 2:21 pm
As a fan of gyroscopic input, I hope it’s in there.
But even if it is, it would only be a singular input like the 3DS. The game wouldn't be able to track two different input / locations of two different joycons like with the base console.

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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by Stanshall » July 10th, 2019, 2:32 pm

Gyro for Splatoon is essential once you get into it, and motion controls are easier for Odyssey than shaking the entire console (although that did make me laugh) but generally, the games which require or promote motion or gyro are pretty average. ARMS is vastly improved with traditional controls and the motion marketing arguably scuppered its chance to be considered for what it really is - a deep, tactical, technical fighter.

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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by Alex79uk » July 10th, 2019, 2:50 pm

KSubzero1000 wrote:
July 10th, 2019, 2:18 pm
Suits wrote:
July 10th, 2019, 2:11 pm
The biggest bad point I can see so far is the fact there is no way to connect it to the TV either out of the box or with additional peripherals later on.
Yeah, not even putting in an HDMI port is a bold design decision
I suppose there still needs to be an incentive to buy the 'full' version though.

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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by hazeredmist » July 10th, 2019, 2:50 pm

ratsoalbion wrote:
July 10th, 2019, 2:15 pm
I can only assume other people treat their hardware like shite!
😆

My N64 analogues never broke, my GBAs are both still near perfect, as is my GameCube, my SNES and N64 were both still in tip-top shape when I sold them, my N3DS XL is pristine bar a few touchscreen scratches.

I’m not going to argue about the Switch’s kickstand, but I’ve not had a problem with any other aspect of it (although admittedly I use it docked 95% of the time).

I really like the d-pad and the colours of the Lite, but I have no need for one whatsoever.
Certainly not me, all my points are valid and widely known... I treat my hardware very well. Just ask my wife who will tell you I'm insufferable with this :D The 3DS issue with buttons for example is quite simply a design flaw, as they make contact with the top screen and shouldn't.

These are minor moans really. I still love all these consoles!

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Re: The Nintendo news and discussion thread

Post by hazeredmist » July 10th, 2019, 2:54 pm

Stanshall wrote:
July 10th, 2019, 2:32 pm
Gyro for Splatoon is essential once you get into it, and motion controls are easier for Odyssey than shaking the entire console (although that did make me laugh) but generally, the games which require or promote motion or gyro are pretty average. ARMS is vastly improved with traditional controls and the motion marketing arguably scuppered its chance to be considered for what it really is - a deep, tactical, technical fighter.
Oddly despite playing Splatoon to a decent level I've never bothered with gyro other than experimentation, I'm much better with tweaked analogue control. But it seems accepted that most high level players will use gyro?

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