Shmups

[KSubzero1000]

Looking forward to hearing how you get on with it, I am jealous!

Of course mate, no problem.

If you have any specific questions or want to see any more pictures, just say the word.

[hazeredmist]

That stick looks fucking badass ksub - brilliant!

In other news my copy of ESP Ra. De. arrived... I'm so excited I've got my Switch with me to try it over lunch.

[KSubzero1000]

Bought a semi-universal Mayflash adapter to play some Ketsui with my shiny new STICK.

Good news: it works!

Bad news: F'N LAG

[KSubzero1000]

Been spending a few hours on MuFu this evening, and honestly, the more I play it the more I like it. Can totally see why Stan went down the rabbit hole with this one.

I think what I like the most is how straightforward it is. The two different combo systems are both very intuitive without the hyperstress-inducing frustrating mess of DDP or the dry inflexibility of Ikaruga. The difficulty settings are as transparent as they come. Readability is excellent. Sound effects are raw and powerful. Visual style is unique without being overloaded. Game is challenging without being needlessly obtuse.

Top marks all around, definitely moving up a few notches in my personal CAVE ranking. It really needs to be ported onto Steam and modern consoles yesterday.

Stick is dope, the more precise movement is certainly a much appreciated improvement. Coming straight from the 360 pad and its Chicxulub impactor-level of precision probably helps with the comparison, too.


(Chapter 3 is still my roadblock, so there's obviously a lot more room for improvement here...)

[hazeredmist]

Amen - I posted that on twitter earlier. I keep getting excited that their posts are about Overpower coming to switch but I’ll have to wait a little longer.

[KSubzero1000]

https://www.siliconera.com/m2-announces ... aepo-2020/

M2 getting serious.

[Stanshall]

The hidden cost of shmups:

The words 'schmup' or 'shump' make me wanna smash stuff.

Edited out a long list exaggerating the impact of the genre for 'comic effect' but probably better addressed in my post below.

[KSubzero1000]

The word [...] 'shump' make me wanna smash stuff.

I KNOW, RIGHT? They keep doing it, too!

Seriously, are you okay there? Did anything happen or is it just an exaggeration? Should we be worried?

[Stanshall]

It's mostly absurd exaggeration to stop myself from being an idiot, but I did just smack my Pro Controller and scuff the foot stool which is absolutely stupid behaviour. I remembered why I stopped playing Ikaruga first time around. It feels like one of those co-ordination game test things where you have to pass the metal loop around a wire without touching it. Just a series of failures with very little reward until you finally nail it. It doesn't inherently feel very satisfying to me, it's the idea of nailing it which is satisfying.

I have made significant improvements over a couple of days, managed to go up the columns and bomb the remaining nine ships and stuff like that. Use missiles to little clusters of ships, scoop up the suicide bullets and quickly missile the next cluster. Some really cool, satisfying little stuff but there are some sections which I find more frustrating than anything I've ever played. That 'shoot through the eye of the needle' bit after you do the columns is agonising and so irritating that there's no save states or even restart button. I know I've been spoiled basically by M2 ports but it's the ultimate restart syndrome game and it isn't good for my sanity. Grinding DOJ chains and dying to stray bullets on Futari God Mode for hours is nothing compared to how frustrating I find Ikaruga.

And to be honest, I also think I have developed a weird relationship with the genre where it's kind of ruined my ability to relax with a game. I get so easily turned off by games which don't have some kind of specific challenge. Previously, I would have happily enjoyed sauntering through DQXI or Days Gone or Resident Evil 2 but now I quickly find them boring. Even stuff like Astral Chain bored me almost immediately. I find it difficult to concentrate on anything slower paced. I can barely watch a film for more than ten minutes, even something I really like. I really loved RDR2 and HZD recently but that was through hammering the main stories because I find open world stuff completely inane.

Basically, though, I feel like I had to push myself to get past that hump and then I really loved the slower pace and the atmosphere and story stuff as much as I ever did. I'm just used to constant immediate gratification and feedback from playing shmups and I feel like on several levels, that's not great. I feel like I should give them a break for a while, but then I think, well, they're the games I most enjoy and find most exciting. It seems stupid to stop playing Battle Garegga just because it makes me unable to get into Tokyo Mirage Sessions or something. On the other hand, I recently stopped drinking coffee and cut out sugar and while I initially felt a bit dazed and sluggish, I feel like I have more energy than I have done in years, my sleep is better and so on and so on and I stopped craving caffeine and sweet stuff. I feel like that's a pretty decent parallel.

[KSubzero1000]

Okay, so now I'm the one sitting comfortably playing MuFu with my glorified crowbar while you're torturing yourself on Ikaruga in order to impress the kids. We've officially entered Bizarro World.

Take it easy, mate. At least the Switch Pro Controller can always be replaced. Much easier than your wrinkled mitts or your contraband-grade RAP-EX, anyway. Deep breaths.

Yeah, that part with the column at the end is an absolute nightmare. All of those restarts can get to you, I wholeheartedly empathise. And it's just the first chapter, too!

It feels like one of those co-ordination game test things where you have to pass the metal loop around a wire without touching it. Just a series of failures with very little reward until you finally nail it.

Excellent comparison, btw!

[Stanshall]

I edited in some broader points about my thoughts on the genre, its impact and the double-edged Stockholm Syndrome it engenders.

My Pro Controller is fine but I do feel that it's pathetic behaviour.

[KSubzero1000]

I feel like I should give them a break for a while, but then I think, well, they're the games I most enjoy and find most exciting. It seems stupid to stop playing Battle Garegga just because it makes me unable to get into Tokyo Mirage Sessions or something.

I know it probably sounds like a total platitude, but please take care of yourself. Sounds like your intense relationship with this genre is affecting other elements of your life for the worse. If you need to step back a bit in order to regain some of your equilibrium, do it.

Dunno what your physical situation and exercise habits are, but some light endurance sport might very well be the perfect antidote to your current issue. Forces you to focus on something that is physically draining but mentally calming. Just take it slow at first (remember that marathon episode? ). Go run for 30 minutes with some nice relaxing music a few times a week and see what happens. You might find yourself getting rid of all that pent-up energy / frustration and be more relaxed and capable of concentration afterwards. Apologies if I'm crossing a line or something, but I think it'd be worth trying if you aren't already.

Oh, and good job with the dietary changes, btw. It's so easy to get hooked on all sorts of garbage without realizing it.

[Stanshall]

No, it's a fair question and you're not overstepping the mark given what I've said. I actually do plenty of exercise, mostly walking, but I will step that up further as it gets a bit warmer and will head out more on my bike. Generally, I'm feeling pretty good these days, lost about thirty pounds over the last three months just through better diet, minimal booze and walking and I'm pretty much as trim as I have been in a decade.

Spoiler: show

In terms of stress, though, yeah, life is pretty full on at the moment. I was in a team of three middle manager roles where I was doing two of those roles and the other one was pretty new so I was effectively mentoring him on how to do his job. I made enough of a fuss about the workload that they hired someone else at that level and promoted me to manage the two of them, and gave me more strategic input for the company as a whole. While I appreciated the gesture of support and encouragement, the person they hired had a nervous breakdown after a couple of months (which possibly tells you something about the workload) and so I went back to managing her team on top of my new stuff. I was also asked not to tell anybody why she's not at work so I had to manage her team in a subtle way that didn't undermine her in case she were able to recover and come back. I think this is a fucking stupid approach and terrible management, frankly. She's recently come back but she's basically not up to it, she needs professional help, she needs a proper break and she's not in the right mental place to do the job. This is far far from the most important thing here but given that I'm talking about my own stress levels it's a simple fact that my job is much harder for having her back, because I need to also do her job but very delicately so she doesn't feel undermined and so nobody in her team knows that I'm doing her job for her. On top of that, my boss (top level) is struggling with her own family problems and so she's quite regularly not doing her job thoroughly in ways that have a direct impact on me and which make me look like an incompetent, disorganised cunt. I'm not the kind of person to throw her under the bus but it's starting to bother me. Again, I'm not being unkind, she really can't help it, but it's having a significant impact on me and I don't see how it can end well for her and so there's not really a light at the end of the tunnel unless I basically whistleblow which I don't want to do and which would be incredibly unkind in the circumstances.

On a positive note, I like a lot about the job, it feels rewarding and there's a direct meaningful impact to what I do, and while I'm not earning loads and loads, we don't really want for anything and I am able to take a decent amount of time off pretty much whenever suits me. I just work a fuckload harder than I think is healthy, and have done for a good year and a half now and I am pretty tired of other people's problems and covering for them. I think most people who know me would say I'm an empathetic kind of guy so I feel like a bit of a bastard for saying that, but I am really tired and stressed by it. That's what's having an impact on me, really.

It's interesting, though, that Ikaruga specifically is the game which opens up my Tin Man heart like a can of tomatoes and finds that it's full of tar. Futari makes me feel like it's full of sherbet.

[Stanshall]

Problem solved, I just threw my arcade stick out the window and put my foot through the telly and put it over my head like a big rapper's necklace and started screaming.

[Stanshall]

Why do you do it to yourself?

Get that ikaruga shit to fuck, man, it's asking too much of you for minimal gains. If it was a relationship, you'd be out of there last week.

This is really solid advice and the relationship analogy is fucking spot on. It's a great game but it's not a fun game for me. It's got under my skin but that's not enough in itself, nor is it necessarily healthy, like going out with a girl you really fancy but who is an emotionally withholding droid. As I say, I've never been so frustrated by Futari or DOJ or Psyvariar or Rolling Gunner or even DFK. Go beyond the genre and I never felt so frustrated and annoyed by Bloodborne or Dark Souls or Celeste or Sekiro or Cuphead or Tropical Freeze or any other 'hard' game I've ever played. Ikaruga is just so particular and restrictive that there's not enough sense of success or joy in the mere act of playing it, for me, at least.

As for why I do it to myself, the challenge itself is really addictive to me and the bits of progress I've made over the last couple of days playing it again made me feel like I could get S++ Rank. To be honest, I feel sure that I could, I fixed my stick (one connector had come loose) and instantly did the skip up the columns, but at what cost...and to what end? I would feel satisfied when I did it but I would largely hate the grind to get there. That's a weird way to entertain yourself. When I compare that feeling with how much fun I have every time I've fired up Garegga recently, it seems mental that I'd ever spend my time that way.

Anyway, a lot of thinking out loud here but yeah, being a bit stressed and knackered and first weekend hungover in a couple of months and Ikaruga is a crap combination for me.

[KSubzero1000]

Anyway, a lot of thinking out loud here but yeah, being a bit stressed and knackered and first weekend hungover in a couple of months and Ikaruga is a crap combination for me.

Yeah, that makes sense. It's certainly a very special type of game and I've also noticed it doesn't lend itself at all to the pick-up-and-play nature of most CAVE games, for example. Tried a few times to get back into it and found it positively impenetrable.

Really sorry to hear about all the stress you're currently dealing with at work and everything. Sincerely, take care of yourself. Health and sanity are more important than video games.

[Stanshall]

Thanks for the assorted kind words, gents. I won't quote but I appreciate the concern and advice.

By kind of chance, well, not at all, it was by design, I arranged a meeting with my boss to discuss the work situation and she said she completely agreed that I was doing too much because she'd been overwhelmed herself and stuff had slipped between her fingers which I'd been picking up. She's made a proposal to restructure things. It's by no means a done deal or even a promotion for me but it's an acknowledgement that it's been fucked and it still is and it's unfair. Maybe it will change very much in my favour, maybe it'll just change and I'll benefit from that. At the same time, and this is coincidence, I've been offered a job elsewhere which I'm unlikely to take but which is a bit of a morale boost.

I'm finding it difficult to drop Ikaruga though because I'm very close to nailing the hardest section, but at the same time I want to smash up my telly. I need to somehow get the idea into my thick skull that it is not an achievement, that it means absolutely fucking nothing and that every step along the way will be painful and shit and will ruin my evenings if I persist. I just don't like quitting, though. That's it. I don't like admitting defeat. I nearly admitted defeat with Defiled Amygdala in Bloodborne but eventually did it after experiencing a terrible existential despair that I was simply not physically and mentally capable, but I did it. I had it even worse with Ikaruga first time round when I was going for S Rank but I did it, although it completely ruined the game for me for a long time.

How can I put myself through it again?

The final bullshit timed random section of The Witness, I never did. It still makes me feel a deathly dread when I think about it. My brain is not what it was. My nervous system is slowly dying. I can accept my mortality but I struggle to come to terms with my fading faculties. I should be able to S++ Rank chapter one of Ikaruga. Why? To prove a point to the Reaper? To blow my own trumpet? Probably both. If I give up now, what of the wasted time and energy and emotion I've already wasted on it? Sunk cost fallacy, perhaps, but I'm not someone who gives up, even when it's making me feel like shit. That's no attribute, unfortunately. It's probably the nature of being an overcompetitive control freak.

The Shmups thread is not just about celebrating the highs, humblebrags and sharing our 1CCs, though. It's also about the pit of despair and the sputtering phoenix drowning in its own flames. If you're going to try, go all the way. Perhaps I've gone as far as I can.

[KSubzero1000]

Oh neat it's Monday again, Stan went full Dostoevsky on us.


Seriously, as much as I love Ikaruga, it really isn't worth it if it causes you so much discomfort.

I understand your point about not wanting to give up until you accomplish what you set out to do. Really, I do. Action games in general and shumps in particular tend to attract the type of audience who just wants to go the extra mile and understands the value of perseverance. I've been there, many times. But there comes a point where single-mindedness simply causes more harm than good. If it isn't healthy for you then it might be more advisable to step away, at least for now. Hate to see you in the dumps like this.

I'm not saying give up, just... please don't lose perspective, that's all.

(Not 100% sure what I'm getting at. I just don't want you to burn yourself out, basically.)

Besides, there's plenty in life worth achieving that doesn't hinges on the *triple threat chaining FROM HELL*. Just a thought. You could always join that competitive mikado community center you've been dreaming about, for example.


Remember that owl and dog odd couple I used to try and cheer you up with? They're still hanging in there somehow.

Click to release endorphins:

Spoiler: show

Chin up, Freundchen.

[Stanshall]

Thanks, I appreciate the concern and the cheer. To me, that stick in the dog's mouth is Ikaruga and I am the dog incapable of letting go while you are free to perch for a while and fly away and return whenever you like.

To be honest, I am largely OK, just a bit frustrated by it but I'm nevertheless making progress. This evening, I gave it another hour and did the columns probably twenty or thirty times. On one particular occasion I missiled the rest, destroyed the big black ship and absorbed the bullets, quick killed the big white ship and only bloody well threaded the needle and chained into the big black ship, switched polarity and threaded the damn needle again before destroying the last big white ship and getting an extra six or seven chains. Guaranteed S++ coming up! Oh no. What a shame that I fucked up the middle of the stage so it was pointless except proving that I can do it with a bit more practice and consistency.

I don't understand why sometimes the big ships appear too soon. That's what's screwing me. I've got the needle threading totally nailed, just sometimes the big ships get in the way. To thread, you have to do a little tap to just fire one bullet rather than the double laser. Maybe you already did this, I can't quite remember.

I will give it two weeks and then I will accept whatever the Fates decree.

[Stanshall]

In nicer news, well done, clippa. You're damn close. That final boss is what stopped me from 1CCing Espgaluda.