Hollow Knight

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JaySevenZero
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Hollow Knight

Post by JaySevenZero »

Here's where you can contribute your thoughts and opinions for Hollow Knight for potential inclusion in the forthcoming podcast.

A friendly reminder that where the feedback for the podcast is concerned, we love it - but keeping it brief is appreciated. We do want to include a breadth of opinions where appropriate, but no-one wants a discussion podcast that’s mostly reading out essays. Better to save yourself time and cut to the chase if you can.
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Tolkientaters
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Re: 505: Hollow Knight

Post by Tolkientaters »

Hollow Knight looks like an incredible game, I'm a big fan of From Softwhere, so I like the influences you can see from Dark Souls. It's amazing how such a small team combined elements of Dark Souls and Metroid to such a successful degree. The world looks great with just enough personality to keep you pushing through the ruins, I just wish I was better at it.

I'm not a particularly skilled player especially when it comes to 2D games, so I've never been able to get that far despite loving the aesthetic and their approach to combat. I might try to go in again, but with such a plethera of games to play, it just doesn't feel as good to keep playing a game where you aren't making progress. I respect Hollow Knight and love it's ambition, but I don't think I have the skill or will to really appreciate it.
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stvnorman
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Re: 505: Hollow Knight

Post by stvnorman »

I 90% adore Hollow Knight, and I’m talking favourite games of all time “adore,” but the rest is pure, undiluted hatred! It’s beautiful, and exploration and progression are brilliantly realised, as is everything about controlling him. And then there’s some of the bosses, and some of the checkpoints just before some of the bosses, and they absolutely stink! I deleted the game twice before I completed it, but I always knew I’d be back, just like I will the minute the sequel appears, to love and hate all over again!
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Alex79
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Re: 505: Hollow Knight

Post by Alex79 »

This game was a perfect example of right place, right time for me. I came to it at an exceptionally low point in my life a few years ago. I'd been suspended from work for something that wasn't my fault and the threat of losing my job was very real. My brother was also in hospital, the wrong side of a life threatening illness (he recovered) and I was sitting at home by myself all day every day looking for ways to escape my own thoughts.

Hollow Knight was a game, rich with atmosphere and lore that I could just totally lose myself in. From my first steps in to Hallownest to the final seconds, I just loved everything about it. The melancholy music suited my mood perfectly, and the almost oppressive overtones of the game were something I found oddly comforting at the time. A little guy fighting against insurmountable odds was something that just resonated. The traversal and the combat was another highlight for me, and I relished the ridiculously difficult platforming sections, just trying and failing and trying and failing again and again until finally managing a perfect run and the success that came with it. I loved the character design, the bosses, the whole style of the game. Hollow Knight is probably my favourite MetroidVania I've played so far, and I really can't wait for the sequel.

THREE WORD REVIEW: Melancholy, Masterful MetroidVania.

EDIT: I've got a YouTube channel, it's mainly just for videos of my band but I'll occasionally upload some game footage. My video views are usually in the 10s rather than the thousands, but for some reason, one of my Hollow Knight videos seemed to explode. Now, I use that term lightly, because in YouTube terms it's peanuts, but I just thought it was funny that one video I uploaded out of everything I've ever done seemed to catch so many views. It's currently sitting at around 53k views (compared to another Hollow Knight video I uploaded, currently on 11 :lol:) Anyway, it's here: https://youtu.be/AR1B2MAgkgU
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JCVanDan
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Re: 505: Hollow Knight

Post by JCVanDan »

Hollow Knight is one of all time favourite gaming experiences. I adore the melancholy aesthetics that permeate all parts of the game. From the incredible mournful soundtrack, through to the bleak world design. It all comes together to make Hallownest feel like a real place and I became totally lost in the place. I have extremely strong memories of hearing the echo of my battles in those deep dank places, and the relief of hearing the strange chatter of one the world's weird inhabitants, knowing I'd found a spot of relative safety in that oppressive place. There's lots you can say about the mechanics of the game, most of which I really enjoy, but for me the lasting memory of the game is it's intense sense of place and the almost sorrowful feeling it gave me while playing it. I absolutely love this game and I'll be there day 1 for the sequel.

One other thing I want to mention is that we should all take a moment to appreciate the time we are currently living in as video game enthusiasts. It's insane that the tools now exist to allow a 2 person team to make something this good, that is so beloved by so many people. What a time to be alive!
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Toon Scottoon
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Re: 505: Hollow Knight

Post by Toon Scottoon »

The first time I played through this game on Switch I didn't know exactly how good what I had in my hands was. I'd never played Symphony of the Night, Super Metroid, or any of the other myriad of games that they inspired. Still I was hooked on this title, and blew through a very basic playthrough in about a week, loving the sharp combat and the tainted ant farm aesthetic.

Three years later I returned to the game right after playing Metroid Dread as a point of comparison. After a very full playthrough, what I found was that although I have love for both titles I prefer Hollow Knight to even the most recent entries in the 2D exploratory action RPG genre.

Some of my preference can be chalked up to the combat, which builds intensity and urgency with close quarters engagements and a textured application of HD rumble. Simultaneously the interplay between the music, art style, and art direction, the designers commitment to sharpness and the themes of light and dark, all left an impression on me as a player. And the variety and creativity displayed in the game's powerups took me by surprise. However, Hollow Knight's true masterstroke seems to be its premise of a bug themed world. By choosing to shrink down the setting there became something believable about this tale of destiny and destruction. I'm not saying there's anything entomologically reasonable that goes on in this story, I just mean that it felt believable that somewhere in the universe, a world this small could develop into something so rich and detailed, full of personality, culture, and character. And although distant planets or haunted castles could also house such wonders as those contained within Hollownest, there is some sense of rubber mask wearing in those realms that I don't feel in the subterranean environment Team Cherry created here.

Three word review - Had me buggin
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Wuqinglong
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Re: 505: Hollow Knight

Post by Wuqinglong »

Hollow Knight is a game I really enjoyed...eventually. I first tried some years ago but dropped it after about 45 minutes. I found the first area quite dull, the combat was serviceable and felt satisfying to an extent, but I had other things I wanted to play waiting at that time. Some time later a good friend was enthusiastically recommending the "Bug Game" he had been playing which turned out to be Hollow Knight when I inquired. This still wasn't enough to make me pick it up again right then and there but the seed had been planted in my mind.

Fast forward to the present and I am happy to say I've completed the game thanks to the added incentive of the Cane and Rinse schedule. I still don't like the first area of the game much but once you move on from it I daresay the feeling of atmosphere that is evoked is probably the best I've played in the genre, and I've played a lot of the genre. I really did feel engrossed in this world of bugs and was always excited to see what a new area looked like. The City of Tears is literally dripping, pun intended, with character, somber, eerie, and beautiful. The incredibly adorable grubs were a great reason to explore every nook and cranny. I was still ultimately somewhat disappointed in the combat, it felt great dashing and slashing but the bosses fell short of the challenge I was hoping they'd provide given how much power the player has in terms of movement. The final boss in particular was a bit of a "wait that's it?" moment.

Even if Hollow Knight wasn't the most impressive when it came to memorable combat, for me it still delivers a unique experience in its genre I feel stands tall among the likes of Symphony of the Night and the best Metroid titles. My critiques may come across as a bit negative but I only nitpick to this detail for games I really like or really dislike and Hollow Knight is definitely in the former category.

3 Word Review: Save. The. Grubs!
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DaMonth
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Re: 505: Hollow Knight

Post by DaMonth »

They can take as long as they need to on Silksong, because I know whenever it gets a release date, I'm going to have to replay through this game and that means tackling all the optional parts and DLC and killing the sun. Not sure if I'm emotionally ready for that. Good game. Every game's better with Ducktales pogo'ing.
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shadowless_kick
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Re: 505: Hollow Knight

Post by shadowless_kick »

I purchased Hollow Knight right around the beginning of the lockdown period, rightly anticipating having plenty of time to explore its vast world. Though I was a relative newcomer to metroidvanias, I was excited to expand my horizons and give this one a try, especially after reading so many great things about it.

Right off the bat I was impressed with its aesthetic and unique, dour mood, and I was quickly pulled into its world and lore. Unfortunately, the actual gameplay didn’t make the strongest first impression. The protagonist wasn’t especially fun to control, and the knock-back from enemy hits was frustrating and difficult to adjust to. Additionally, the way the sound temporarily cuts out to emphasize damage taken was really jarring, yanking me out of the flow of combat precisely when I needed to feel it the most. I pushed on, though, confident that yet-to-be found upgrades would at the very least make my character nimbler and more fun to move around.

And they did, but as I uncovered more of the world, the backtracking became increasingly grating, even after unlocking the fast-travel points. Gradually my frustrations started seeping into other aspects of the game, souring my overall experience. The unsettling way larger enemies in particular seemed to sit on top of the surroundings rather than exist within them started creeping me out. Additionally, the game's penchant for tossing you into nearly completely dark environments really set me on edge. Creepy, surreal enemies? OK. Stages almost totally devoid of light? Challenging, but I’ll do my best. Creepy enemies stalking around stages devoid of light? The camel’s back has been broken.

Once I realized I was playing more out of a sense of duty to finish rather than because of any fun I was having, I ejected the disc and it never returned.

I totally get why this game has the glowing reputation it does, and I wouldn’t hesitate to recommend it to the right kind of player. But I'm not the right kind of player for Hollow Knight. I’m glad I gave it a go, though.

Three-word review: molasses-thick atmosphere
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KissMammal
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Re: 505: Hollow Knight

Post by KissMammal »

I can understand on a certain level what makes Hollow Knight appealing to so many people. I can appreciate how the challenge the game presents and the lack of handholding gamers have become accustomed to might feel refreshing and novel in this day and age.

Though aesthetically the game isn’t my cup of tea I think it’s objectively a good looking game with a strong, consistent style.

I get all that.

But I just couldn’t shake the feeling while playing that a lot of the challenge presented to the player seemed arbitrary, and only served to artificially stretch out what should, I think, have been a challenging but much shorter game.

Classic Metroidvanias generally have a satisfying feeling of momentum and progression whereas playing HK too often felt like stumbling around in the dark, hitting one dead end after another. Compounding this feeling of aimlessness is a world map that is sprawling but sorely lacking in both memorable landmarks and visual variety. People rave about the atmosphere of each of the game's areas, but to me with a few exceptions each area looks and feels much like another and this makes the map as a whole feel bland and very hard to commit to memory.

It’s not so much the difficulty of the moment to moment gameplay that put me off, but aspects of the game design that others found so refreshing (such as the relative scarcity of fast travel points) just came off to me as the game needlessly wasting my time and started to make traversal of the game world into a chore.

Enemies in Metroidvania games tend to be pretty easy to overcome for a good reason. The relative toughness of the enemies in Hollow Knight for me made backtracking, and especially retracing my steps to each boss encounter, into a tedious slog. The Youtuber Nerrel described the game as a ‘Sisyphus Simulator’ and I couldn’t agree more.
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MauricioMM
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Re: 505: Hollow Knight

Post by MauricioMM »

Before I tried my hand at Hollow Knight I was a little aware of how the game hatched a good reputation in many critics’, and players’, hearts. However, even though I’m skittish towards boarding some hype trains with slightly uncertain destinations, I still felt the itch to witness this game myself in order to really understand what made it click for other people, what made it special for a metroidvania, a genre which, even though I admittedly neither got a buzz out of nor was bugged by, I was a bit eager to seriously dig into at that point of my gaming life but only if it was with a game like this one, a game that I expected to be a good flutter. (And before you ask, yep, all those very poor attempts at insect-related puns were intended :lol: )

And well, after the first few hours, the reasons why many loved it quickly became quite evident to me: its charming-in-its-lovely-weirdness visual style that set it apart from most games then and now, the cleverness of its combat and level designs, its challenging but (mostly) fair Castlevania-meets-Soulslike difficulty, its moody but marvelous soundtrack, its somber but curiously exciting storyline, and the simple joy of experiencing a setting with such a mix of beauty, darkness, and adventure. Mainly these things were what made me eventually fall in love with the game and develop an almost-newly-found appreciation for the genre.

My only regret with the game was not being both skilled and patient enough to conquer some of its toughest challenges, specifically the Path of Pain and the second half of Godmaster’s content. But, hey, at least I managed to beat Nightmare King Grimm! ...after dozens of attempts :lol:

P.S.: It’s funny, yet understandable, how its upcoming sequel, Silksong, has sort of taken the place of Half-Life 3 as unofficially The Most Hugely Awaited Sequel in gaming. I hope it doesn’t take a Valve-Time-long, well, time for Silksong to see the light of day, though.

---

My three word review:
Goth Bug’s Life
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Mr Ixolite
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Re: 505: Hollow Knight

Post by Mr Ixolite »

By the time I played Hollow Knight, I was pretty burnt out on Metroidvanias. To borrow a phrase from I believe Michiel in the Axiom Verge episode, too often I found the moment to moment gameplay uninspiring, too often they became tedious and repetitive.

Hollow Knight singlehandedly reinvigorated my interest in the subgenre.
Every place you find in Hollow Knight feels unique. They have their own look and atmosphere, and their own environmental gimmicks. Greenpath feels different than the ancient basin, navigating the conveyor belts of Crystal Peak is wildly different than the cramped corridors of Deepnest. In general theres a lot of actual platforming to go around, and though I know the White Palace is controversial, I loved that Hollow Knight became pseudo-Celeste for a little bit. Even the act of exploration itself is exciting, courtesy of the less-is-more choices regarding mapping. Finding a bench and watching the Knight scribble down your latest expedition is almost better than getting to save your game.

But even more importantly, probing the depths of Hallownest constantly reveals new enemies and bosses, and almost every foe in Hollow Knights incredible bestiary is memorable to look at and to fight. It reminds me of the Classic Castlevania games in that every hit you receive and dish out feels like they matter, especially due to the incredible feedback systems. Absent-mindedly spamming attacks or engaging in wars of attrition are never viable strategies, and managing to score two hits in a row on a boss before escaping to safety feels like you’re dancing on a knifes edge. Stealing a moments reprieve to recover feels exhilarating. The fights may be brutal, but in the end I’m glad I beat The Radiance not by grinding levels or by a large supply of potions or pasta dishes, but by pure tenacity and skill. I have no intention of beating Godmaster though, that’s a bridge too far.

And while normally I am not fond of the modern style of obfuscated storytelling, where it feels like the story itself is a puzzle to be solved, even here Hollow Knight managed to pique my interest. I think it comes down to almost all the characters you meet being grounded in relatable desires and motivations, with no more knowledge of the deeper lore than yourself, which prevents things from becoming too oblique.
But I also think it comes down to the fact that the deeper you pursue the storys’ trail, the more beautiful locales, devious platforming and exhilarating fights you would uncover. Under normal circumstances I am pretty liberal with using guides for gaming, but here I came to regret any knowledge I had going in, any moment of weakness of checking a wiki.
The biggest compliment I can give Hollow Knight is that whenever its sequel comes out it will be the first game in ages I will purchase upon release, and I will go in as blind as possible.

Three Word Review: *SIGH* Ba Fanada?
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Seph
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Re: 505: Hollow Knight

Post by Seph »

Hollow Knight is definitely a perfect example of a game reaching the levels of hype that preceded it. As a big fan of Metroidvanias, I was perhaps already inclined to enjoy this more than most people. But even the biggest skeptic of this genre can't ague against this game's brilliance.

Firstly, the look and animation style of the characters and world are stunning. It's almost so simple and cartoony in its presentation, but it means that every enemy, NPC and location are bursting with personality. And the fact they avoided using the now-cliched 16-bit pixel art style and went with something more original only makes it look more impressive.

The gameplay is tight and perfectly balanced. Other than the true final boss and a secret DLC battle (which I have never beaten and never will), I never felt the difficulty to be cheap. Whenever I did come across a difficult fight I still felt victory was within my reach and I just had to try harder. I think I perhaps reached the Broken Vessel fight a little too early, but each time I tried I felt myself learning and improving, so instead of coming back later I put in the time and finally beat it.

The [take a drink] Dark Souls style of storytelling, where it gives you just enough information to piece together the plot and backstory, and uses the environments to add more to the lore, is executed well here. It's not only a great way to encourage exploration in the player, but it also gives fans the opportunity to discuss it and built up the game's reputation. Discovering new areas became addictive to me; and it was this, more than anything else, that pushed me to play for "one more hour".

Overall, I'd rank this as one of the best games of the last generation (only Nier: Automata and Bloodborne are higher on my list) and one of the few solid flag-bearers of crowd funded gaming. Metroidvanias are ten-a-penny these days, but save those pennies to buy this instead, if you already haven't
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Truk_Kurt
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Re: 505: Hollow Knight

Post by Truk_Kurt »

I can see the feedback for this game being really positive and rightly so, I can see why people adore this game. For me however, it wasn't for me. The metroidvania genre is one of if not my favourite genre and after hearing the lavish praise for this game I was excited to give it a go. I have given the game two attempts, seperately by a couple of years but neither time was a success. The problem was more with me than the game, I just wanted some more guidance in the early game as I was just wandering around with little clue as to what I was supposed to do or where to go. I was in the first area, kept dying and losing all my souls (or whatever they are called), going to collect them but then either die shortly afterwards or on the way there. I just found it incredibly frustrating and not fun. When I came back for a second attempt, I went in with some tips and focused more on just exploring every nook and cranny, I did get further and up to the first boss. I died which was fine but then saw I had to go all the way back to the last bench rather than the start of the battle. This is a huge bug bear of mine and immediately sours my opinion of any game which has this mechanic, it drives me mad having to do the run up to a boss every time I die rather than just start the battle again, giving me the choice to go back into the environment to grind and level up if I wish instead. I did try a few attempts at that first boss but eventually lost patience and knew it would be the same thing for every boss afterwards so eventually just put the game down in the knowledge I had given it my best shot.
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sam_c
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Re: Our next podcast recording (5.2.22) - 505: Hollow Knight

Post by sam_c »

I adore this game. As a testament to how much I love this game, it's one of the few games of its scale I've fully completed (112% completion). And I'm not particularly good at games. Those DLC bosses took me a long time. It's also one of the few games that's got me well into the lore.

The greatest joy of this game is the exploration. The game does not hold your hand, but cleverly makes sure that which ever way you go, you can make progress. The number of times playing this game that you think "wow" after discovering a yet another new area. It also welcomes sequence-breaking, especially with nail-bouncing (I got into the Hive before getting the Monarch Wings. I got my ass kicked pretty hard).

The combat and charm system are also great strengths. There's some seriously hard bosses in this game, but all can be broken down by mastering their patterns and executing perfectly. Sometimes a change in strategy is needed, swapping out the nail for spells, or focusing on nail arts.

The soundtrack and art design are obviously top-notch. So many memorably dark places, characters, and accompanying soundscapes. And it only gets darker the more lore you know.

As for weaknesses of the game... not all bosses are that interesting (quite a few just float around and alternate between two attack patterns). Also, as has been pointed out before, the combat in the early game isn't that interesting, and it takes a while to get deeper. The shade cloak appears pretty late and really changes the dynamic of some of the bosses when you face them again in DLC (Watcher Knights are one of the main quest's hardest bosses, but they're trivial with the shade cloak). In general I don't mind the game's overall slow pace --- exploring the world slowly is enough of a joy for me. But a few more combat options early on wouldn't go amiss.

Absolutely can't wait for Silksong.
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jackdarcy42
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Re: Our next podcast recording (5.2.22) - 505: Hollow Knight

Post by jackdarcy42 »

Long time listener, first time poster. I had to register in order to contribute my thoughts on what is possibly my favourite game of all time.

The game gets a lot right. The art style is gorgeous and charming. The soundtrack is sublime. The gameplay is tight, fluid, responsive and inventive. The mechanics are generally diegetic in very satisfying ways. The atmosphere and environments are captivating, and the lore is surprisingly deep and well realised (when you scratch beneath the surface with your Dream Nail).

But even with all of that, I think the game really is more than the sum of its parts, and everything comes together in some really magnificent and unforgettable ways. I'll never forget stumbling my way through some forgotten nook or cranny to hear Cornifer humming away in the distance. Walking through the City of Tears for the first time. Challenging the Mantis Lords with nail held aloft. Teaming up with Quirrel to take down Uumuu. Climbing up the atmospheric Kingdom's Edge. Feeling my skin crawl in Deepnest (and also: Nosk! Christ almighty). Piecing together some of the stories deepest mystery's beneath the Ancient Basin. And perhaps my favourite moment of all - finally making it into the White Palace, with some of the best music in the game accompanying our little hero's trials within. To name but a few... really, every single zone has it's own memorable stories and moments. I could spend all day typing them out, to the point where I might as well livestream a whole play through and it would achieve the same thing.

Yes, it's a tough game. And I've never beaten the true final boss (or tackled the DLC). But, contrary to what I often see said elsewhere, I never found it unfair or disrespectful of my time. When I died, I always knew what I could have done better, and came back emboldened to try again. I find very little to fault with this game, and it comes very very close to being perfect. It utterly captured my imagination and will stay with me for a very long time to come.
bixer

Re: Our next podcast recording (5.2.22) - 505: Hollow Knight

Post by bixer »

As a huge 'Metroidvania' fan typically, I first tried Hollow Knight 3 years ago and while I did appreciate how much attention was clearly given to its development, I ultimately hit a wall about 8 hours in where I just got tired of making seemingly no progress with a couple of bosses I'd been struggling with and having no idea how else to proceed.

Fast forward to just last month actually (January 2022) and in finding myself with a bit more 'free gaming time' than usual in that post-Christmas quiet period, I decided to give Hollow Knight another college try. This time it sunk its mantis claw into me and I found myself losing 40 hours to it in barely more than two weeks. Approaching it with a bit more patience this time round and making sure to explore every nook and cranny, I realised that there aren't really ever any moments where you should be truly stuck, as there's always another route you can explore instead for a new charm or ability that might help you to overcome that stubborn boss.

It's hard not to sound hyperbolic, but this second attempt made me truly believe it to be one of the best games ever made and I've very quickly gone from not caring at all about the sequel to someone who will be buying Silksong day one.
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Re: Our next podcast recording (5.2.22) - 505: Hollow Knight

Post by ashman86 »

I had a friend who raved about Hollow Knight on Twitter shortly after the game launched, so when the game hit Switch, I decided it was high time to give it a go. Shortly after, I traveled to South Africa for work, which amounted to something like 48 hours of time spent on an airplane. I was looking forward to some time with the game and had every intention of finishing it as I traveled.

I made it to the first fight with Hornet, finally beating her after at least a half-dozen tries, when my battery died and I discovered I'd packed my charger in a separate bag from my carryon (I am not an experienced traveler). So I spent the next 12+ hours on the flight without my Switch, desperate to return to the game.

On the flight home, I made sure not to make the same mistake twice, but alas! The seat I was in did not have a working outlet, and I was once again forced to give up the game after a few hours, but by now I'd broken the first seal on the Black Egg and was making good progress.

Back at home, I picked up the game once again and made my way into the Nest of the Spider Tribe and was utterly horrified and delighted by the creepy-crawlieness of it all. I broke the second and then the third seal, and then! I put the game down and stepped away from it for a time. You ever feel like you're not ready to end your time with a game, so you just leave it unfinished for a while? Guess that's where I was at.

After a year or two, I was ready to return to Hollow Knight, but I decided I wanted to start fresh. I bought the game on Steam this time around, and even though it had looked and run amazingly on the Switch, it looked and ran even better on PC! I ended up tearing through the game, knocking out most bosses on my first try despite not having had to fight them in more than a year, and I eventually fought my way up to and defeated The Radiance. It's since become one of my all-time favorite games, and I think I'll return to it and try my hand at some of the more advanced challenges in the Godseeker DLC before Silksong comes out (whenever that happens).

Hollow Knight influenced me afterwards in some unexpected ways. Its Souls-like somber mood and narrative approach sparked something in my imagination that I've carried over into my own writing. But it also had a more pragmatic and mechanical influence I never would have guessed. Because of the less-than-stellar "d-pad" on the Joycon, I found myself using the analogue stick to play the game primarily while in handheld mode, and I didn't stop even after switching to my Switch Pro and later an Xbox Elite controller. After decades of swearing that 2D platformers were best controlled on a digital pad, I'd finally converted, even completing all of Celeste with the analogue stick as well.
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